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The Sew What’s New Archive
This archived content is from Mary Wilkins’ sewing and
quilting message board “Sew What’s New,” which was
retired in August 2007. It is being provided by
“Sew What’s Up,”
which serves as the new home for many members of “Sew What’s New.”
From: blackie
Date: 07-31-2005, 02:08 PM (1 of 21)
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Has anyone done this? I have a couple specific patterns I am interested in but they are spendy ($15 - $20 apiece) and I was thinking it would be neat to borrow one. One of these patterns is one I only want to use *once* and another is a pattern I just want to examine to draft my own. I have several myself, plus the expertise of working with them, and would be willing to trade, loan, and assist others who wanted to use my patterns. I know patterns can be only 99 cents at Joann's. But I don't get to the sales that often for one thing (live out in the sticks), and use other patterns than the big 4. I also think it would be fun and could build community. For instance, it would be cool to have a pattern database of everyone's patterns so people can peruse others'. I have mad computer skills and could volunteer for this. Does anyone ever do this or is it totally gauche? Am I just taking crazy pills to think of this? (also posted in the Swaps board). see the mundane life of a housewife.
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User: blackie
Member since: 03-31-2004 Total posts: 594 |
From: wp88
Date: 07-31-2005, 03:15 PM (2 of 21)
| It could be a good idea but would it be legal because of the copyright the pattern companies hold. Just a thought. |
User: wp88
Member since: 03-28-2005 Total posts: 35 |
From: bunzino
Date: 07-31-2005, 04:31 PM (3 of 21)
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It is DEFINITELY illegal. nancy |
User: bunzino
Member since: 08-16-2002 Total posts: 119 |
From: blackie
Date: 07-31-2005, 04:34 PM (4 of 21)
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One of the main things I was wondering about was the legality. I thought about it and I honestly don't see how it could be illegal if no one is making copies of the pattern and no one is doing it for profit. So does that mean when my girlfriend borrows a pattern for a couple days to make a pair of pants, then returns it - that is illegal? Any experts on this subject - explain! 
see the mundane life of a housewife.
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User: blackie
Member since: 03-31-2004 Total posts: 594 |
From: carman
Date: 07-31-2005, 07:17 PM (5 of 21)
technically yes  it was bought for YOUR use.
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User: carman
Member since: 04-17-2000 Total posts: 692 
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From: carman
Date: 07-31-2005, 07:18 PM (6 of 21)
just do a google search and you will see the HOURS of reading on this subject 
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User: carman
Member since: 04-17-2000 Total posts: 692
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From: bridesmom
Date: 07-31-2005, 09:41 PM (7 of 21)
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What if you had a pattern that you didn't use any more and you were willing to give it away, then you shouldn't be caught in the red tape, would you? It would be like a recycleing of patterns
Laura
Tickled pink with my Innovis 4000D |
User: bridesmom
Member since: 01-21-2004 Total posts: 2026 |
From: mamagoose
Date: 08-01-2005, 09:48 AM (8 of 21)
| Wouldn't that mean re-selling patterns, books, anything copyrighted being illegal? If it wasn't originally purchased for the second-hand person? |
User: mamagoose
Member since: 01-26-2002 Total posts: 168 |
From: Hogmami
Date: 08-01-2005, 10:14 AM (9 of 21)
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So you are saying that the second hand stores and yard sales shouldn't be selling patterns, and books? I buy alot of that stuff at those places and have never seen the pattern police around.
Carolyn
Michigan |
User: Hogmami
Member since: 09-30-2004 Total posts: 800 
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From: DorothyL
Date: 08-01-2005, 11:09 AM (10 of 21)
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As I understand copyright -- You can't copy a pattern and sell it. You can't claim it is your creation -- and sell it as such. Sometimes selling more of the finished product -- like a finished dress --than a specified amount is considered claiming it is your design and you can't do that. You can buy or sell second hand. You can trade. You can gift copyrighted material. You can loan the article. You paid for it, it is yours and you have the right to use or dispose of it. The reason for the copyright laws is to protect the creator's -- designer, writer, musician, artist or whatever -- work, especially financially. It is like if you borrow a CD from a friend. That's legal. Technically you can't copy it but no one cares. But if you make a bunch of copies and sell them and they catch you, you are in trouble -- like Napster. If you are a threat to their financial rewards from the work, the person or company owning the copyright may press charges. I'm not a lawyer. Dorothy |
User: DorothyL
Member since: 12-09-2002 Total posts: 3883 |
From: blackie
Date: 08-01-2005, 11:19 AM (11 of 21)
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As I understand copyright -- You can't copy a pattern and sell it. You can't claim it is your creation -- and sell it as such. Sometimes selling more of the finished product -- like a finished dress --than a specified amount is considered claiming it is your design and you can't do that. You can buy or sell second hand. You can trade. You can gift copyrighted material. You can loan the article. You paid for it, it is yours and you have the right to use or dispose of it. The reason for the copyright laws is to protect the creator's -- designer, writer, musician, artist or whatever -- work, especially financially. It is like if you borrow a CD from a friend. That's legal. Technically you can't copy it but no one cares. But if you make a bunch of copies and sell them and they catch you, you are in trouble -- like Napster. If you are a threat to their financial rewards from the work, the person or company owning the copyright may press charges. I'm not a lawyer. Dorothy There are lots of varying opinions on the subject here! Dorothy, your explanation makes the most sense so far. I'd like Mary to weigh in on the subject! see the mundane life of a housewife.
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User: blackie
Member since: 03-31-2004 Total posts: 594 |
From: carman
Date: 08-01-2005, 11:44 AM (12 of 21)
i have a tiny issue with this statement  i have a few friends that are struggling musicians, and copying CD's in anyway but for your personal use is taking money from them. sure when you think of it on the scale of of "just me" it is not much, but think of 10,000 people saying "just me" and "who cares" when it comes to quilting things i have learned that each designer is a little different, some say you can make one to sell and others say you can sell 10, but no more, and the credit pattern and designer must be on the label of the quilt. there are some that say you can not sell their designs at all, giveing away is another story, as no profit is made. when you take a pattern to a copy shop, if you are copying a pattern they won't do it, you can do self serve, but the store can not legally do it themselves. so don't think on the scale of Napster, think on the scale of one "who cares" turning into many "whats the difference"The reason for the copyright laws is to protect the creator's -- designer, writer, musician, artist or whatever -- work, especially financially. It is like if you borrow a CD from a friend. That's legal. Technically you can't copy it but no one cares. But if you make a bunch of copies and sell them and they catch you, you are in trouble -- like Napster. |
User: carman
Member since: 04-17-2000 Total posts: 692
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From: carman
Date: 08-01-2005, 11:46 AM (13 of 21)
| oh i forgot one thing, with quilting patterns i believe that in order to call it YOUR design, 75-80% of the original design needs to be changed, i am not sure if is learned that from this site or from my guild, but htose numbers come to mind. |
User: carman
Member since: 04-17-2000 Total posts: 692
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From: LeapFrog Libby
Date: 08-01-2005, 12:28 PM (14 of 21)
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Carman, I think quilt patterns are a horse of a different color altogether.. So many of the patterns are more than a hundred years old, who knows who they belong to.. The general public is my answer...Clothing patterns are a different thing altogether.. They are original creations of a designer today and therefore subject to copyright laws.. Sew With Love
Libby |
User: LeapFrog Libby
Member since: 05-01-2002 Total posts: 2022 
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From: plrlegal
Date: 08-01-2005, 12:54 PM (15 of 21)
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For whatever it's worth Blackie, I think you and a local group could much more easliy swap, trade or whatever you want to call it, patterns, if you're swapping like I'll trade you a Kwik Sew for your McCall's pattern. however, you cannot copy those patterns to distribute to other people or you cannot make multiple garments from the same pattern to sell in a public forum. I for one would not take the chance of instituting or participating in a public forum, such as this board, for buying, selling, trading, etc. copyrighted garment patterns. And, when it comes to quilt patterns, that is an entirely different world from copyrighted garment patterns and not related. Patsy Patsy
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User: plrlegal
Member since: 05-19-2001 Total posts: 318 |
From: MaryW
Date: 08-01-2005, 01:09 PM (16 of 21)
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This was written about two yrs. ago but I don't think there have been new additions since then. http://www.sew-whats-new.com/copyright.shtml It is a very gray area. To be on the safe side, I would NOT trade or buy or sell publicly. Every designer has their own understanding of the laws. Depending on their interpretation, you may or may not be in hot water. I know of a lady who made a Dear Jane quilt. Then when she offered it for sale all hell broke loose. I also know of a designer who sells patterns. When we offered exposure for her product by making one up and displaying on the site, she told me we were not allowed. There are many others who are more than grateful for that sort of mention. Go figure. 
MaryW
owner/editor of Sew Whats New |
User: MaryW
Member since: 06-23-2005 Total posts: 2542 
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From: MyGirlFriday
Date: 08-01-2005, 05:26 PM (17 of 21)
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who would have thought it! Glad that we have some people here that understand the copyright rules. It is amazing that people can actually sell or give away anything that they make .....Wonder who holds the copy right on crochet "Granny Sqaures".....  I hope it was my Granny!! LOLmgf~ 
Blessings & Smiles
Frogs have it easy....they just eat what's buggin' them. |
User: MyGirlFriday
Member since: 12-05-2004 Total posts: 288 
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From: paroper
Date: 08-01-2005, 07:33 PM (18 of 21)
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It is my understanding that the pattern belongs to the original purchaser of the pattern. Technically, making several dresses for several people from the same pattern may be a "no no". I understand that you can make several garments for the original purchaser of the pattern but not for other people. The copywrite seems to have different loop holes. In the case in embroidery designs, for instance, you purchase an embroidery design from one place it may say that you can sell a quantity or unlimited number or gift them but you cannot give or sell the actual design to someone. Other places say that their items can not be sold but can be given away, but they all say that the actual design, program, CD, etc, cannot be sold or transferred. I have one program that is limited to the original user using the product at the purchasing address (I wonder what happens if you move...can you still legally use it?) The embroidery copywrites often even extend to the size, colors and actual design itself, so that by copywrite you cannot change size or color of the embroidery nor are you supposed to change it physically in any way. One thing for sure, with all the rumored lawsuits and all, you sure don't want to be caught up in court over something like a 99 cent or even a $25.00 pattern...you have a whole lot more to loose. Vogue, by the way is now offering a service to allow you to purchase out of date patterns. I don't know how it works, but since it is owned by McCalls, I would expect McCalls and Butterick to follow suit. I heard a rumor on another site that if you go to Disney World in an embroidered shirt (homemade) they will check a list to see if it is "authentic" before you enter. If it is not, you have to change shirts before you enter. pam
Bernina 200e, Artista V5 Designer Plus, Explorations, Magic Box, Bernina 2000DE & 335 Bernette Serger, Bernina 1530 Sewing Machine, Bernina 1300 DC Overlock (with coverstitch) |
User: paroper
Member since: 02-03-2004 Total posts: 3775 |
From: plrlegal
Date: 08-02-2005, 12:09 PM (19 of 21)
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With the millions of people that go through the gates at Disney World every year Pam, they would have to have a gazillion shirt police. I've been to Disney many, many times when I lived in Florida and never heard of or saw anyone stopped for what they were wearing. Patsy Patsy
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User: plrlegal
Member since: 05-19-2001 Total posts: 318 |
From: MaryW
Date: 08-02-2005, 04:00 PM (20 of 21)
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I heard about the Disney shirt thing too. There was a local daycare here in Halifax with a Mickey Mouse in the window. Someone made them take it down.
MaryW
owner/editor of Sew Whats New |
User: MaryW
Member since: 06-23-2005 Total posts: 2542
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From: Sancin
Date: 08-03-2005, 06:19 PM (21 of 21)
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Interesting site!! http://www.templetons.com/brad/copymyths.html *~*~*~* Nancy*~*~*~* " I try to take one day at a time - but sometimes several days attack me at once."
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User: Sancin
Member since: 02-13-2005 Total posts: 895 
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