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From: weezyrider
Date: 01-19-2007, 09:02 AM (1 of 25)
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How do pattern companies test the patterns? I just finished a quick and dirty hoodie. The instructions were for fleece - not specifically sweatshirt fleece. The pattern also calls for side vents. Now I can see some poor beginner buying the cheap fleece because it's all the store carries, and it is cheap and trying to turn a 5/8 inch edge over double to finish this. Would be way too bulky. Since fleece doesn't ravel, it said nothing about finishing any other seams, although it did give a quick and dirty about a flat-felled seam for the hood. Also for the cording for the hood, it just said don't sew between the dots. No reinforcing or anything else. I overcast the seams and will probably topstitch down. If you can see the 2 thread overlock on the sides, too bad. I've tried to make vests from this cheap fleece, and putting a zipper in can be hell. I'm just wondering if new sewers find this discouraging or what? Weezy 
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User: weezyrider
Member since: 08-19-2003 Total posts: 218 
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From: DorothyL
Date: 01-19-2007, 11:40 AM (2 of 25)
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I know I just made a coat where the pattern just kind of 'you're on your owned' me when it got to the lining. I wasn't difficult to figure out -- but I've figured out a lot of patterns and done a lot of linings. I would be hard for someone newish to sewing to figure out though. To be fair the pattern wasn't marked easy. A lot of people seem to think that sewing is so easy they can go buy a machine and be dressing the family for pennies or selling stuff on ebay next week. Those people are going to be discouraged anyway when they find out it isn't as simple as it looks (to them) and many of us spent years learning what little we do know. I don't know that you can blame the pattern companies for all the misunderstandings. Part of it is just our culture of instant gratification. That said, sometimes I think they could make it a little clearer even for me and I've been sewing for a very long time. Dorothy |
User: DorothyL
Member since: 12-09-2002 Total posts: 3883 |
From: Marlyn
Date: 01-19-2007, 01:15 PM (3 of 25)
| I quite agree about problems with patterns. I like many others sewed for a great many years, including clothes for my husband, children, and neighbours, then left it for some years due to my returning to work and travelling. Now I find that instead of simply taking your measurements and applying them to the pattern before cutting, I am now looking at three different sizes to ensure a proper fit. What happened? I know my body has changed, but my off the rack clothes have not changed in size? |
User: Marlyn
Member since: 06-11-2004 Total posts: 37 
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From: paroper
Date: 01-19-2007, 01:32 PM (4 of 25)
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Chances are that if your off the rack patterns have not changed in size, you have. Over the years since 1967 or so, when patterns and RTW sizes were standardized, the rack patterns have steadily gotten bigger and bigger. People tend to use the natural ease built into these patterns as part of their "size" so it is a little hard to tell but a lot has to do with vanity sizing. On the other hand, the patterns have not changed, although designs come and go and the amount of ease varies with the designs. There is a clue to the amount of ease in the pattern descriptions and if you look in the back of the book, it gives a guide to show what loosely fitted, fitted, etc means in terms of ease amounts (there is a chart.) For years you had to decide your pattern size and if you got it wrong, you just had to alter the pattern. You also had to measure all the pieces everywhere to determine how much ease was on the patterns. To save money they have started combining 3 or more sizes for most patterns (I LOVE that!). Now you can cut a size 14 bust, 16 waist and 18 hip and not have to figure everything...or do a 14 bust and hips with a size 18 waist (great stuff)! http://www.voguepatterns.com/tech/ease/ease.html However, I do agree that pattern instructions aren't what they used to be...BUT many of us were taught to sew in school or by family members. Now, many people have to learn on their own. While the pattern companies take into consideration that most know how to sew, it is no longer true and they need to either give more specific directions or perhaps give online lessons that give more details or even if they would print a book with suggested applications that could be purchased to go with their guidesheets it would be a lot easier for beginners. There are a lot of people out there who have forsaken patterns and are stuggling, trying to reinvent the "wheel" when it comes to sewing. Pattern companies need to find a way to reach out to those people. Then there are others of us who have sewn even a lot in the past and given it up for a career...now we are gradually returning to sewing and our skills are rusty...those needs also need to be met. pam
Bernina 200e, Artista V5 Designer Plus, Explorations, Magic Box, Bernina 2000DE & 335 Bernette Serger, Bernina 1530 Sewing Machine, Bernina 1300 DC Overlock (with coverstitch) |
User: paroper
Member since: 02-03-2004 Total posts: 3775 |
From: colojd
Date: 01-19-2007, 01:47 PM (5 of 25)
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I have been sewing since I was 12 and owned/operated my own fabric, quilting and craft store for six years as well. I was asked this question a lot by customers. I think all sewers have tried a pattern that just did not seem to go together either technically or fashionwise. I asked several pattern reps about this. They all said that each pattern has been tested. But I think that probably in some cases, they design that pattern based on just measurements and other details, but never give it a true test run. Here is a little hint that may help you. If there is an actual photograph of the garment or craft, this shows that somewhere along the line, the pattern company did an actual test garment. Of course some of these garments may then have had alterations or fittings to make them look better on the model, so it still is not a perfect way to know it has been tested but a good general idea. Also, I was told my several pattern companies that if the garment is pictured on the pattern, the first fabric listed is supposed to be the one pictured. For example, if you pick out a wedding dress pattern, and it shows a model wearing this gown, and the first suggested fabric is satin, most likely that is what is in the picture and the fabric that they felt would give the best results. I knew a lot about sewing when I started my shop, but never stopped asking questions! It was fun to learn more and I always passed it along to my customers! Joyce |
User: colojd
Member since: 05-03-2002 Total posts: 83 |
From: Sherri
Date: 01-19-2007, 02:35 PM (6 of 25)
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I just finished a pattern and it never had the step where you sew the side seams. I read the pattern five times to figure out what I missed. I did not miss it!! But luckly like the rest of you I have sewed a billion years looked at the pictures and just did it. It makes sewing very difficult for newbies when patterns are like this. If you go one ebay and buy actual Vintage patterns the difference is remarkable. Sherri My website
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User: Sherri
Member since: 02-07-2001 Total posts: 357 |
From: PaulineG
Date: 01-19-2007, 04:15 PM (7 of 25)
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I've only been sewing for about 8 or 10 months so I definitely still qualify as new. I am a bit of a pattern freak (100+ - imagine how many I'll have when I've been sewing for 10 years) and have bought most of them either in thrift shops or on ebay. The differences in quality of instructions still stuns me. I have a few patterns I own that I'm just not yet ready to try until I have a bit more skill under my belt. They're waiting for me when I'm ready though. I also have a few that I thought looked okay but partway through I just gave up on the pattern and went my own way or the item became a UFO  . The only reason I can think of for the poor instructions some patterns contain is the attempt to save money by the companies - false economy! I'd rather spend a bit more but get something that I can use. Pauline
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User: PaulineG
Member since: 09-08-2006 Total posts: 901 |
From: weezyrider
Date: 01-20-2007, 09:59 AM (8 of 25)
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When I said test the patterns, I din't mean just construction - I also meant finish. Do they finish the seams? I use a lot of Kwik Sew. Their patterns have instructions for both serger and sewing machines. I have 1 very old Simplicity for sweatshirts, and one for Tshirts (about 15yrs old). The instructions are much clearer. I've heard complaints from other sources about people wanting instant gratification. They don't have the patience to survive a learning curve. Weezy 
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User: weezyrider
Member since: 08-19-2003 Total posts: 218
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From: sewingrandma
Date: 01-21-2007, 02:52 PM (9 of 25)
I remember back when I first started sewing, in the dark ages  all the notches used to be numbered in the order in which they were supposed to be sewn. Made it very easy to put a garment together when you knew which seam to sew next. I've found all sorts of errors in directions and have pretty much stopped using them except as a guide as to which seams to sew next and use the garment construction techniques I learned long ago. Anything I'm not familar with I come here, to the library, my reference books, or to the Web.
Brockie
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User: sewingrandma
Member since: 03-06-2003 Total posts: 432 |
From: toadusew
Date: 01-22-2007, 08:46 AM (10 of 25)
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I have also found errors in modern patterns, and am grateful that I now have enough sewing knowledge/experience that it doesn't frustrate me like it did when I was a new inexperienced sewer. As others have mentioned, I think the pattern companies assume that those using a commercial pattern also have some knowledge/experience in sewing, and that is often not the case. My mom tells me that when she was sewing, the pattern instructions were clearer and more specific than they are today. |
User: toadusew
Member since: 01-08-2005 Total posts: 369 |
From: paroper
Date: 01-22-2007, 01:24 PM (11 of 25)
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They've tried to do too much while keeping the same number of pages. They've added additional languages and taken away some small illustrations, added larger illustrations that are harder to read. There was a time when you didn't have to be reading literate to sew..you could follow the pictures...they've taken those out to add languages. I'd much rather see them sold in the "main" language and let the dealer stock the directions in a second and/or third languages for each pattern that would be free to those who need it. Each area know their clientile so they would know what tot order pretty quick. That would allow them to remove/save the pattern directions in a language they could read with good directions and we would have the same advantage. You wouldn't need as many extra sheets as patterns per design in most cases. It wouldn't take an Einstein to figure out which patterns would more like see or be needed in additional languages. If the English language was less prevelant than a particular "other" language in some areas, they could stock the patterns in that language with English directions as an option.
pam
Bernina 200e, Artista V5 Designer Plus, Explorations, Magic Box, Bernina 2000DE & 335 Bernette Serger, Bernina 1530 Sewing Machine, Bernina 1300 DC Overlock (with coverstitch) |
User: paroper
Member since: 02-03-2004 Total posts: 3775 |
From: temom
Date: 01-24-2007, 08:38 AM (12 of 25)
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My little one wanted to make baby doll clothes with me. So we bought a pattern and she chose the most complex outfit, but I over-ruled her and chose the simplest. AAACCCKK it was horrible. I've done facings before, but couldn't figure this one out for the life of me. They didn't give directions that were needed. I finally made do and decided to forget the facing and just hem the neckline. The babydoll isn't going to complain, for pete's sake. I think i've been traumatized by this pattern, as I just want to trash it.
Theresa
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User: temom
Member since: 01-19-2007 Total posts: 410 
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From: bridesmom
Date: 01-25-2007, 10:25 AM (13 of 25)
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I have a pattern like that, it was a uniform pattern that Simplicity offered for free. Well, I know why it was free, it was the worst pattern ever. I realize the unisex are really large in their sizing, but the fit was bizarre. I'm sure it may have fit someone, somewhere, somehow.
Laura
Tickled pink with my Innovis 4000D |
User: bridesmom
Member since: 01-21-2004 Total posts: 2026 |
From: diannab
Date: 01-26-2007, 06:46 PM (14 of 25)
Okay, I totally agree!  I started sewing Feb 06 ;D almost at my one year anniversary and almost got my serger!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! hehehheehehe ;D But my first pattern was one of the major brand... can't remember the name and it was instantly thrown away after finishing! lol ;D Any way it was one of those sew quick sew easy patterns. OMGah I wanted to kill the pattern maker! It was a tank and capris I figured extremely easy since I won't have to set in sleeves ;D  lol It said you can sew in an afternoon. I was like YAH! and you know what, after many tears, and many times using my seam ripper, and 4 months later I finished it! I was so proud of myself! I kept at it and figured it out all by myself ;D lol As I have NO ONE to teach me! But I did it! I could see many people being turned off on sewing by this. Funny thing is, the worst thing was joining the pants at the crotch. They didn't give any explanation whatsoever, except to have wrong sides out pin at seams and sew  But now..... It's all good ;D Cause I am cool like that   
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User: diannab
Member since: 10-28-2006 Total posts: 78 |
From: LegalDealer
Date: 01-28-2007, 07:55 PM (15 of 25)
| Okay, I have read all the above...I am stumped! How can we avoid these pattern problems altogether? Is that possible? I haven't looked, but is there a pattern website that would give us help when they give us bad patterns? |
User: LegalDealer
Member since: 10-19-2006 Total posts: 27 
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From: paroper
Date: 01-28-2007, 07:58 PM (16 of 25)
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There are several books out there. I would suggest looking at your local library to find a good general reference book. Don't forget though that we are always here to help, daze and confuse you where we can (hopefully we'll more help than the later two). pam
Bernina 200e, Artista V5 Designer Plus, Explorations, Magic Box, Bernina 2000DE & 335 Bernette Serger, Bernina 1530 Sewing Machine, Bernina 1300 DC Overlock (with coverstitch) |
User: paroper
Member since: 02-03-2004 Total posts: 3775 |
From: temom
Date: 01-28-2007, 11:02 PM (17 of 25)
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Legal Dealer, My favorite book is "Sew With Confidence" by Nancy Zieman. I was attempting a T-shirt in a knit, and my sleeves were terrible. I ripped them out (leaving holes), and asked myself "what would Nancy do?" I checked the book, and tried her way, and it worked. Now I'm finishing the shirt just so I can learn how, and start over again on fabric that doesn't have holes from the seams being ripped out over and over. I'm glad I was trying this on bargain fabric!
Theresa
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User: temom
Member since: 01-19-2007 Total posts: 410
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From: DorothyL
Date: 01-29-2007, 08:08 AM (18 of 25)
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Some of these problems stem, in part, from lack of experience of the sewer I think -- not the patterns. The patterns -- even the easy ones -- give directions. They are not sewing lessons. Some times the pattern companies just give dumb ways of doing things so a reference book or two can help either explain the method suggested or give tips for a better way. Or you can ask the rest of us. Some people do very well without patterns at all but most of us at least need the template to cut out. If all else fails -- there is always Pam!! Dorothy |
User: DorothyL
Member since: 12-09-2002 Total posts: 3883 |
From: Debzy
Date: 02-06-2007, 11:51 AM (19 of 25)
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One of my first ever sewing disasters occured when I was using a Mccall's pattern, to make myself a twinset (strappy top and cardigan out of the same fabric) It was a 'jerseys only' pattern, which was fine as I had some lovely jersey to use. However, the instructions told me to interface the neckline facing on the strappy top. With no prior experience of interfacings, and no guidance on the pattern, I used a standard fusible... which of course fused to the jersey, preventing it from stretching! So i couldn't even get the stupid thing on! A little hint like 'use the stretchy fusible stuff' would have been most welcome. I didn't discover stretch interfacing until a few years later! |
User: Debzy
Member since: 06-02-2003 Total posts: 71 |
From: bridesmom
Date: 02-12-2007, 11:02 PM (20 of 25)
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I just finished a jacket with a collar band on the collar, first time I'd ever tried to do one of these, and the directions were so bizarre I couldn't make head nor tail out of them. It was a Burda 8171 http://www.thesewingplace.com/index.asp?PageAction=VIEWPROD&ProdID=4189, with really abbreviated directions and lousy pictures. I finally had to get out my sewing books and see if I could find any collars like this one. It took me two hours to get the stupid collar on and I finally did it my own way. But I love how it fits!!! Laura
Tickled pink with my Innovis 4000D |
User: bridesmom
Member since: 01-21-2004 Total posts: 2026 |
From: plrlegal
Date: 02-13-2007, 11:24 AM (21 of 25)
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I thought about this thread when I started working on the wool crepe jumper I'm making and I took the pattern instruction sheet out of the pattern envelope and really took my time and read through each step and all the instructions and explanations at the beginning of the sheet for layout, fabric folding, placement, etc. and I thought the pattern was pretty comprehensive and clear and it also has diagrams for each step about trimming seams, notching seams to allow for ease when putting the facings on, etc. I really tried to put myself in the place of a person just learning to sew and even then I thought the pattern pretty much explained and showed how to accomplish each step. Patsy Patsy
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User: plrlegal
Member since: 05-19-2001 Total posts: 318 |
From: LadySloPokes
Date: 03-14-2007, 08:47 AM (22 of 25)
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I learned the basics about sewing in high school decades ago. I was able to remember most of it, about how to read a pattern, the grainlines, notches, sewing seams, etc. However it has taken me a while to understand some of the instructions that some of pattern makers have put in. It seems like they are skipping a step on occasion, or the directions are not worded very clearly. If there is a diagram or drawing of the step, my feeble brain may have a hard time trying to match up their written directions with what the diagram is showing. I have no doubt that this would be extremely frustrating for anyone with little or limited sewing experience. Paroper is right that everyone who is serious about learning how to sew should find a really good instructional book to get them started. I have several, and all of them are full of step-by-step photos of each direction or instruction. The books are able to answer some of my questions and sometimes I'll be able to apply their method to a specific step if the patterns instructions just won't work for me. I have also found that the pattern makers don't use very good grammer with their written directions, making it even harder to understand the instructions. I have complained to one pattern maker about that, and they deny that their instructions are too hard to understand because of the wording. Just gotta love big business!
Cookie
LadySlo...yes am I, but hey, I'm gettin' there! Are you sure it's supposed to look like this?! Proud owner of Singer Quantum Decor 7322 & Singer Quantum Futura CE 200.. "A balanced diet is having chocolate in both hands!" |
User: LadySloPokes
Member since: 08-15-2005 Total posts: 198 
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From: DorothyL
Date: 03-14-2007, 09:40 AM (23 of 25)
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I was just thinking about this thread. The pattern for the jacket I am making has the standard line for facing -- "edge finish long unnotched edge." We've all seen it dozens of times. Except in this particular case the inner edge of the facing is notched because it is the same pattern piece as the front and you match the notches to the side front. The outside edge is, in this case, unnotched except at the center back. I caught it right away but a less experienced sewer might not have. It probably wouldn't ruin the garment but it would be a pain to deal with. It would really have been a pain for me this time because I bound the edge of the facing (after I cut the notches off) to match the Hong Kong seams. And my fabric really ravels so I would have lost some serious width in the facings. Dorothy |
User: DorothyL
Member since: 12-09-2002 Total posts: 3883 |
From: weezyrider
Date: 03-14-2007, 06:44 PM (24 of 25)
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Your replies are why I started this thread. The instructions can make you feel soooo stupid at times. I usually can't look up stuff in the library, I have better books! (Unless you want tailoring). I have a Kwik Sew pattern that makes a nice shirt, but the collar is too short by at least 2 INCHES! I checked the lines I traced about 6 times and it's the PATTERN!! I just added the needed amount in the center. I've also found the wrong facings marked. I guess QC is slipping all over. But if more experienced sewists can have this problem - I am feeling real sorry for a pure beginner. Home Ec was required when I was in school, but my mother sewed better than the teacher, so I learned from my mother. Now it's more like working on the computer. Grab a piece of muslin and have at the idea. Usually the worst thing that will happen is a lot of ripping out! You didn't break the computer if it shows the BSOD! Weezy
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User: weezyrider
Member since: 08-19-2003 Total posts: 218
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From: Debzy
Date: 03-16-2007, 12:02 PM (25 of 25)
I've just remembered - I was teaching a lady to sew once, and the Burda pattern was wrong  they just hadn't added a seam allowance to the centre back facing piece.Luckily, I realised what they'd one, and we retraced and recut the piece. But if she'd been learning at home, on her own, she might have thought it was her error... |
User: Debzy
Member since: 06-02-2003 Total posts: 71 |
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