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The Sew What’s New Archive
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From: Bama
Date: 02-26-2007, 07:21 AM (1 of 70)
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I was in the grocery store over the weekend and went into the women's restroom. There was a young mother standing in line with two little boys. One was around 5 years old, the other around 7 or 8. I didn't think much about it. I remember taking my son into the women's restroom when he was little because I didn't want him in the men's restroom alone. The boys went into a stall one at a time while their mother waited. They were very well behaved and did everything the mother told them. Then the mother went into the stall while the boys stood back. As soon as she locked the door she said, "Let me see your feet." Both boys pressed the side of their face to the stall door and placed a foot underneath the door. Every time they shifted their weight, she reminded them to let her see their feet. The only other people in the restroom were myself and another woman with a toddler. That woman had said hi to them while they stood with their mother and they ignored her. The mother didn't seem concerned about the germs on the door where her boys faces were pressed, but scared to death that someone was going to kidnap them. When they came out, the next woman and her toddler went in while I waited. The mother took the boys to the sink where they washed their hands. I commented on how well behaved they were. The woman and both boys immediately looked down at the floor and didn't say a word back to me and walked out. When the other woman came out of the stall she commented that the boys had peed all over the seat and the floor. The mother didn't bother wiping it up before someone else had to go in there. So, she was teaching them to be afraid of all strangers, but not courteous or polite.  20/20 had a program on a few nights ago about people being scared to death over things like kidnapping. I know that we should be cautious, but I wonder what parents like this are doing to their kids. I wondered if they even get to play outside. |
User: Bama
Member since: 03-21-2000 Total posts: 2116 
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From: DorothyL
Date: 02-26-2007, 08:18 AM (2 of 70)
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Maybe something happened in that particular family to make them behave that way (so fearful). I do sometimes get really annoyed when I see boys old enough to go to the bathroom by themselves take up space in the line to the women's room while little girls and pregnant women are jiggling around while they wait and there is no line to the men's room. If their moms are that paranoid, let them go in the men's room with the boys!! I don't know of many times a father would take an 8-year-old girl in the men's room. Dorothy |
User: DorothyL
Member since: 12-09-2002 Total posts: 3883 |
From: MaryW
Date: 02-26-2007, 08:36 AM (3 of 70)
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It is indeed a sign of the times. I had a very bad scare when my son was just crawling around the floor. It was summer time and he was still in diapers. I will never forget it. Someone called with a very deep voice telling me to keep an eye on my son. They hung up without further conversation. I was alone with 3 kids most of the time and panicked. I called the police and had a detective come to the house. He couldn't do much except to caution me against letting my son go out alone! Obviously that would never happen, but it makes you very uneasy. Maybe that lady had a similar scare. MaryW
owner/editor of Sew Whats New |
User: MaryW
Member since: 06-23-2005 Total posts: 2542 
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From: Pudge99
Date: 02-26-2007, 10:00 AM (4 of 70)
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Well you could be talking about me. I am the let me see your feet Mom (not to the extent that they press their face against the door) and I take my 9 yr old son into the restroom with me. Although if they piddle on the seat I do take the time to clean it up. Most times though I wait for the large stall and take the whole lot in at once. Restrooms are a very dangerous place. Heck just the other day an elementary school boy was molested in the bathroom at school during an assembly. Nobody knew a thing about it until after the assembly when they found him in the bathroom. If it can happen at a school it can surely happen at a store or restaurant. I do like that many places like SeaWorld and stadiums are putting in family restrooms for just this purpose. I am not sure what age I will allow him to use a public restroom alone but be sure it will always be with caution. Gina
Pictures of my successes and failures Pfaff 2040 Janome Mylock 134D Singer Futura CE-100 w/ Autopunch Husqvarna Viking 3D Sketch |
User: Pudge99
Member since: 10-30-2001 Total posts: 1375 |
From: DorothyL
Date: 02-26-2007, 10:55 AM (5 of 70)
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Gina -- Do you have a daughter? Would you want her to go in the men's room? Dorothy |
User: DorothyL
Member since: 12-09-2002 Total posts: 3883 |
From: mommydionne
Date: 02-26-2007, 02:19 PM (6 of 70)
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It's a tricky thing, more and more there are family restrooms (thank goodness), I mean, really, if there is someone lurking in a restroom waiting for a child that is a terrifying prospect, not likely, but still scary. my 10 year old refuses to go in the ladies room, can you blame him, but I will wait outside the mens room for a few minutes and have been known to stick my head in to see if it's empty. Often I will just ask a staff member at restaurants to check too, So I guess I'm the weird lady lurking outside of the men's room  When hubby is out with our 8 year old daughter he sends her to the ladies but waits outside as well, he's gotten a few funny looks but he just says he's waiting for her and most people just smile and keep going. She would not care about going in the men's room btw. Hard to tell how old kids are by size too, my girlfriends' 3 yr old is in sz 5 (he's about 4-6 inches taller than my 4 year old) I guess the answer is more family restrooms. Jeanette
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User: mommydionne
Member since: 01-08-2004 Total posts: 838 
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From: Sews4kate
Date: 02-26-2007, 02:37 PM (7 of 70)
My kids are still young, dd is nearly 4 and ds is 9months. But I will be that mom too. But I also am polite and would say "thank you" to you for your comment I am not looking forward to the day ds wants to go in the men's room by himself. I've heard a tip before though, if you each have a cell phone, call the other one so you can "hear" what is going on in there and you could be in there in a flash if you heard something wrong. I'm not sure what age I'll be giving my kids a cell phone, but I"m sure some cheap walkie talkies or something like that would be worth the investment too. My dd goes to the men's room with dh (I've heard they are cleaner than womens restrooms!!). I'm not sure what age that would stop either. But I think we will be figuring out the cell phone thing or someother idea before then for her to go in to the women's by herself. I love the family restrooms they have at our mall, I wish everywhere had that! Wendy
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User: Sews4kate
Member since: 08-20-2005 Total posts: 182 |
From: Pudge99
Date: 02-26-2007, 02:38 PM (8 of 70)
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Yes Dorothy, I have two daughters. My oldest is 14 and went to the men's restroom when she was younger. My youngest is almost 6 and goes to the men's room with her Daddy.
Gina
Pictures of my successes and failures Pfaff 2040 Janome Mylock 134D Singer Futura CE-100 w/ Autopunch Husqvarna Viking 3D Sketch |
User: Pudge99
Member since: 10-30-2001 Total posts: 1375 |
From: PaulineG
Date: 02-26-2007, 03:07 PM (9 of 70)
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This is a toughie alright. I have an 11 yo son who is tall for his age - but he has aspergers syndrome which makes him a bit immature and impressionable. He is certainly too old/large to go into a ladies room but it scares me silly to send him into a mens room by himself. We usually go either to family restrooms or disabled toilets and all go in together. I try to be time conscious so nobody is left waiting for the facilities and so far have not left anybody waiting. When these choices are not available I will (as discreetly as possible) wait outside for a couple of minutes to allow the restroom to (hopefully) clear and then send him in. That way I (in theory) only need to watch out for anybody entering. If he takes too long I'll call out from the door. Hopefully the time will never come that my daughter needs to enter a mens room. I've had to do it myself a couple of times. Only a week or two ago I was at a festival with portable facilities in the back of a semi-trailer (truck trailer). There was a queue of about 40 women at the female end for about 4 toilets or a queue of 5 women (no men when I lined up) for the male end. Guess which end I chose! However when I came out a guy was entering - now the male end had 3 cubicles and a urinal - he went straight to the urinal without a shred of self consciousness. This is fine - I was the intruder in his space - so it was my job to look away or face the consequences as it were. It does make me aware though that even with her dad there (the only way she'd ever need to set foot inside a male restroom) she might be exposed to sights I'd rather not have her see just yet. I have noticed lately an increase of signs stating that boys over the age of 7 are not allowed in female restrooms. Usually these are in close proximity to either family or disabled facilities so it is fairly easy to accomodate. It's easy to see though that with all the nervous parents around there is certainly a requirement for more family (or individual unisex) restrooms. Pauline
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User: PaulineG
Member since: 09-08-2006 Total posts: 901 |
From: Bama
Date: 02-26-2007, 05:05 PM (10 of 70)
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It really didn't bother me that the young boys were in the ladies restroom. What bothered me was the reaction I got when I (and the other lady) spoke to them. I know the mother heard me, but they all 3 looked at the floor and hurried out. I would have at least smiled if it had been me. My kids were told about being careful around people we don't know, but they were also encouraged to be polite and friendly by my example. They are 15 and 18 now and are both outgoing and friendly kids, but have some common sense around strangers when out in public. My sister was over-protective with my nephew, so maybe that is why it bothered me so much. He's almost 14 now and she hardly lets him out of her site. These boys acted scared when I spoke to them. I agree parents with small kids need to be cautious in this day and age, but I don't think it's right to make them afraid of everyone they consider a stranger. And especially to the mom of the toddler. When my kids were little I told them that if we ever got separated in a store, to either go to someone who worked there, or to a mother with young kids and ask for help. |
User: Bama
Member since: 03-21-2000 Total posts: 2116
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From: Sancin
Date: 02-26-2007, 05:23 PM (11 of 70)
Perhaps the family was of another culture. I think if I were in an area where I didn't know the norms I might be nervous. Witness all the weird things that one hears of about cults or abusive families. I am a friendly person who smiles a lot and frequently talks to others or myself while waiting (much to the horror of my children when they were young). A young First Nations woman told me I intimidated her because I looked her in the face when talking as in her culture one lowers one's eyes and is considered rude to make eye contact. And here I have been making eye contact for over 50 years!! 
*~*~*~* Nancy*~*~*~* " I try to take one day at a time - but sometimes several days attack me at once."
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User: Sancin
Member since: 02-13-2005 Total posts: 895 
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From: dmoses
Date: 02-26-2007, 05:37 PM (12 of 70)
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I thought her reaction was 'weird' also. It made me wonder if they were even her kids...I guess now, I'm the one being paranoid! In any event, we all appreciate it when parents have control of their kids in public places, but I think that kind of control is overkill...especially when the children exhibited such fear. Incidentally, that fear could just as easily be a fear of the consequences of not obeying, as much as simply being afraid of the other women in the bathroom. It happens... Take care,
Donna |
User: dmoses
Member since: 02-22-2002 Total posts: 964 
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From: Chrysantha
Date: 02-26-2007, 09:08 PM (13 of 70)
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Theres a woman 2 doors down the street from me, same side of the block. Her twins were 5 yrs old before I knew they were there...I knew the woman and a man lived there, but had never seen the kids. Now our town/street are quiet and all the neighborhood kids play outside, but those two. (I think their mother has a screw loose..married 4 times in 11 yrs...I didn't notice that the men changed, just the cars... ) Across the street a family moved in once about 6 yrs ago. I saw 3 kids...Melanie (across from me, next door to them) said there were 6 kids in that house. They didn't live there long (lost the house to the bank) and I NEVER saw more than the 3 kids...I don't know where they hid the others...but I do know they made a mess of the house...(4 bd, 2 bth, dbl car garage, all brick). They tore out or kicked out 1/2 the cupboards. Pulled all the shelving out, threw food all over the house, and up on the ceilings, didn't clean the whole time they were there (9 mnths) there was actual MOSS hanging from everything in the house. They threw powdered laundry detergent, flower seeds, cooking oil, anything they could think of, all over the garage floor. They also let the termites get into the house...had to replace almost all the outside walls (inside the house...). I've lived all over the US....I've never seen more weird people, filthy people than live down here...(and I seem, to others...to fit right in...the weird part, not the filth) 
Chrys
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User: Chrysantha
Member since: 09-06-2002 Total posts: 2414 
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From: pretnichols
Date: 02-26-2007, 09:28 PM (14 of 70)
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Okay, the behavior seems a little strange to me. And on the otherhand, I feel like I'm not strict enough with my kids. My DS (who's not quite 6) refuses to go in the ladies room. He'd rather wet himself . So I do something like this: I let him go in the men's room, but watch everyone going in & out. If he's taking too long, I just push the door open and call his name. My DD also is into independence and wants to go on her own. If I don't have to "go", I stand "guard" by the door. We have discussed strangers and bad touches quite frequently. Now I'm nervous, based on all these comments, that I am a little too lax in my duties. A lot of it also has to do with where we are. I do recall using the "always answer me" in recent months, when we are someplace that makes me uncomfortable. But the lack of their response, and their real fear makes me wonder if something else wasn't going on, and they were trying to "blend" in with the woodwork. 
Peggy
So little time, sew much to do........... |
User: pretnichols
Member since: 10-16-2005 Total posts: 342 |
From: PaulineG
Date: 02-26-2007, 10:07 PM (15 of 70)
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Peggy we all have that fine line to tread between keeping them safe and teaching them our fears. I know how proud I am of my daughter (and myself) when she moves up close to a big hairy spider (although my heart's in my mouth) but I'm grateful she won't actually touch them. They take in a lot of what we tell them but a lot also comes from things that are unspoken. It's good that they want to do these things independently - it shows they feel secure. Sometimes I'm not sure who I'm protecting with the whole restroom chaperonage thing - my son or my fears. BTW love the new piccie. Pauline
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User: PaulineG
Member since: 09-08-2006 Total posts: 901 |
From: Magot
Date: 02-27-2007, 01:34 AM (16 of 70)
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The risk of anyone being approached in a loo is so minimal that I can't help but think there is a lot of over -reaction here. Children need to grow up with a little risk in their lives or they are so unsure of themselves that they cannot make decisions. It can be an adventure being big enough to go by yourself - yes teach them to look after themselves but give them some space to grow up. The stand with you foot where I can see you is just ridiculous and no wonder they peed all over the place - perhaps didn't speak to you because they were embarressed - or afraid of their mother's reaction if they did. Got to fall out of a few trees before you learn to climb them! love and kisses, Jan
Guts-R-Us Cells a Speciality DNA to order. |
User: Magot
Member since: 12-22-2002 Total posts: 3626 
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From: MotherInLaw
Date: 02-27-2007, 01:57 AM (17 of 70)
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What is purpose of having mens and Ladies bathrooms anyway. They have stalls and why can't they just all use the same bathrooms. If the men can pull up the seat at home they can pull it up other places. That would make this delima manageable. Don't you think? You know I was thinking about that today about getting abducted. I was putting my groceries in the car and thought what if someone came by threw me in the trunk of the car and drove off with my purse they snatched off my arm. then I thought how many people have I come in contact with that were real criminals that were up to no good and just didn't have the opportunity to me something at that moment. It's scary but I'm not going to dewell on it, or I would go crazy if I did.
I'm regressing back into my youth, I just have to figure out how I'm going to convience my body to come along with me.
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User: MotherInLaw
Member since: 06-25-2005 Total posts: 1118 
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From: DorothyL
Date: 02-27-2007, 08:23 AM (18 of 70)
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The only reason I don't like boys in the women's room is that there is always a line in the women's rooms and never in the men's. That's why I say they should have to wait until all the women are finished before they go in a stall. I like that 7-year-old rule someone mentioned. That and by the time they are 9 or 10 they are peeking under stall doors, playing in the sink and being generally rude when mom is in the stall (Not that little girls are much better -- it's just a kid thing) And how embarrassing it must be for them, too. I agree with Jan too, the danger is minimal. They are like 90 times more likely to be abused at home than in a public place. Strangers are much less threat than relatives and family friends. Dorothy |
User: DorothyL
Member since: 12-09-2002 Total posts: 3883 |
From: Pudge99
Date: 02-27-2007, 10:04 AM (19 of 70)
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This post got me thinking. So I talked to my 9yr. old when he got home from school. He said "Yeah it is embarassing but I know it is for my safety and you don't do it a whole lot." I asked him when he thought he'd be ready to go it alone. He said "Well I hope you'll let me by the time I am a teenager at least." We had a bit of a chuckle over that and I assured him that when he was 13 he would be going to the men's room alone. He already goes alone in most places but if I need to go and we are somewhere without my husband then he goes in with me. I do have one question for those of you who are against the boys being in the women's room. Would you be the same person who would turn me in to Child Protective Services if I left my son sit outside on a bench while I waited in the line to use the woman's room? Gina
Pictures of my successes and failures Pfaff 2040 Janome Mylock 134D Singer Futura CE-100 w/ Autopunch Husqvarna Viking 3D Sketch |
User: Pudge99
Member since: 10-30-2001 Total posts: 1375 |
From: pretnichols
Date: 02-27-2007, 10:45 AM (20 of 70)
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Gina, i would never turn someone into Protective Services unless the child was being abused or neglected. I'm sure he knows the rules for those instances when he has to wait outside (and he obviously understands why you do it, as you posted above). Be proud of him, that he feels this way and supports your decision. On rare occasions, I have had to have my DD (9) wait outside a restroom for me. They have strict instructions on what they are to do, but to be honest we've never had a problem. My 5yo son is my biggest worry. He's acts extremely shy to new people (okay, "read" downright rude), but he's small for his size and so immature in some respects. Changing directions from restrooms -- we walk 1/2 block every day to the bus stop for school. There are 13 kids at this stop, and I am the ONLY parent who walks down. My DD gets upset if I don't go with them in the morning, and then meet the bus again in the afternoon. Twice I've had a bus driver thank me for being there, since they've had a probelm with vehicles followng the bus, or strange/erratic behavior. All the other parents count on me to be there -- because they can't or won't. I don't mind, so don't misunderstand me. I love hearing about everyone's day, weekend, or whatever is new. They all vie for my attention to tell me something. I think my own kids sometimes get jealous! But I've had some of these parents ask me why I bother, when I can see the bus stop from my front door. Because they are standing on an open "thru-street" and don't always pay attention to what is going on in their surroundings. We've had a couple close calls when someone steps into the street without looking! And after recent events in MN for those boys being snatched, it's just a better feeling for me. I even check to see who is missing in the afternoon, and let parents know if they are missing. I've had a few freaked-out parents in a panic because their child missed the bus or took a different bus home. I truly think there is a bigger chancd of something happening on a corner than in a restroom too, but am still cautious. I just want to make sure my children are safe, but can still enjoy their childhood! They have to grow up too fast as it is. Just my 2 cents........... Peggy
So little time, sew much to do........... |
User: pretnichols
Member since: 10-16-2005 Total posts: 342 |
From: Magot
Date: 02-27-2007, 10:45 AM (21 of 70)
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No Gina I would not. I might ask the kid if he is OK if I saw him on his own - not a 9 year old though - they go to the shops and walk to school on their own for goodness sake! Public loos in France are unisex Suzie - you walk right past the urinals to get to the cubicles. Doesn't bother the French - as far as I can tell the men pee anywhere....(This is where Isabelle gets me back - but I have BEEN to the Fete de Bayonne and waded through the pee...) love and kisses, Jan
Guts-R-Us Cells a Speciality DNA to order. |
User: Magot
Member since: 12-22-2002 Total posts: 3626
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From: Sherri
Date: 02-27-2007, 10:56 AM (22 of 70)
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I am having a hard time with my own kids who are 8 and 9 about when it is appropriate to let them spread there wings a little and when to keep them in my protective mommy bubble. I don't there is a fine line between expanding there horizons and neglecting there needs. Sher My website
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User: Sherri
Member since: 02-07-2001 Total posts: 357 |
From: temom
Date: 02-27-2007, 11:31 AM (23 of 70)
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I just had to reply on this thread. When my son entered middle school, I allowed him to use the men's room by himself (he is in 7th grade now). If my 6 year old daughter is out with her dad, she goes into the restroom with him. About 2 or 3 years ago I was talking with an acquaintance who works for the Child Protective Service, and asked her if she thought I was being overly protective about the restrooms. She almost shouted back to me NO! She then told me several times in a row "You are not being over protective. Trust me, you are not." Now, I don't/didn't make my kids press their faces into the door, but if they couldn't be in the stall with me (granted, you have those times), and if I couldn't see their feet, I would aske them where they were and to please come closer. Now I have to tell you that I do not live in a large city, the crime rate is about average, and it isn't a terrible place to live! Unfortunatlly, there are people out there who are looking for an opportunity. Yes, children are assulted in rest rooms (My friend's son was approached while his dad was in a stall), children are abducted from bus stops (this week's news), and pedophiles are looking for opportunities. It is very sad, and I wish it were not so. So if you ever wonder if you are being over protective, ask someone in law enforcement or in child protective services. If you are over the top, they will tell you. Theresa
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User: temom
Member since: 01-19-2007 Total posts: 410 
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From: Magot
Date: 02-27-2007, 02:04 PM (24 of 70)
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I am not saying these are not troublesome times but child protection folks are looking for trouble in every corner. I have been on my fair share of child protection courses, and run them, and they do sometimes go over the top. I know it is in the child's best interest but to go in guns blazing at every occasion seems a little extreme. A little knowledgbe is a dangerous thing. Commonsense should prevail - you can take the stall next to your kids and talk to them - you don't need to see their feet. Some children will be fine at 8 or 9 in feeling confident about being separated - others lack the maturity at 13 or 14. You need to know your own child. Please don't think me unsympathetic but the "stranger danger" is ridiculously small - most abusers are known to their victims - friends or close family memebers. You say some children were abducted this week from a bus stop - how big is the population of your country that makes that a viable problem for your children? We teach them how to survive as best as we can - and then we have to let them practice. love and kisses, Jan
Guts-R-Us Cells a Speciality DNA to order. |
User: Magot
Member since: 12-22-2002 Total posts: 3626
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From: Pudge99
Date: 02-27-2007, 02:34 PM (25 of 70)
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Jan, I remember from my time living in Germany that the kids would take the train to and from school. Little ones younger than my son is now. It was one of those culture shock things for me. I could not imagine a mother allowing her child to ride the train alone. Here in my neighborhood the only kids who would walk to and from school would be the ones who's parents don't care or they just live across the street from the school. We are just so paranoid here. So many things on the news, and I have had experience with having the services called on me. Honestly if you must know the truth. I am more afraid of having CPS called than the stranger danger issues. Gina
Pictures of my successes and failures Pfaff 2040 Janome Mylock 134D Singer Futura CE-100 w/ Autopunch Husqvarna Viking 3D Sketch |
User: Pudge99
Member since: 10-30-2001 Total posts: 1375 |
From: plrlegal
Date: 02-28-2007, 01:02 AM (26 of 70)
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Okay, I'm going to take a chance here and say something. Why is it that people will report a parent to CPS, DHS or whatever your child protective service in your state might be, for say a child sitting outside a rest room waiting on the mother and yet, let a child be neglected, roam a neighborhood at all hours alone, etc. and never say a cotton pickin' word? Or, turn away when they see a child being physically abused in public places like grocery stores, etc. because they don't want to get involved? I'll speak up and say something about a child being slapped in the face by a parent in a grocery store a heck of a lot quicker than I would if I see a child (unless they happen to be toddler status where they don't know better than to run off) sitting outside a rest room waiting for a parent. And, single parents think nothing of putting a child on an airplane to fly across the United States in the supposed care of a flight attendant they've never met or don't know from adam? Where the heck is the consistency in how children are protected? They'll go after a parent for using reasonable physical discipline a heck of a lot quicker than they will a parent that is neglecting/abusing a child. Patsy Patsy
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User: plrlegal
Member since: 05-19-2001 Total posts: 318 |
From: DorothyL
Date: 02-28-2007, 08:48 AM (27 of 70)
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Patsy -- I don't think child protective units have the personnel to care if a child is sitting outside of a restroom. Maybe the police would show up if they thought the child was in some sort of danger, lost or matching a missing person's report -- maybe. If the child protective agency had the resources to worry about it, they would have the resources to do more about serious neglect. I don't think these agencies "go after" parents. I think that for the most part they are professionals trying to do their job of protecting children. But, as a reporter covering government, I can tell you that this is one of the first places where budgets are cut to save families tax money so they can go to WalMart and buy junk for their own kids and to heck with the ones that need protection. Dorothy |
User: DorothyL
Member since: 12-09-2002 Total posts: 3883 |
From: paroper
Date: 02-28-2007, 10:52 AM (28 of 70)
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I used to work in a mall store. Our STORE (not the mall) closed their men's room because they couldn't keep down the adult activity there. It is a BIG deal. The customers even altered the stalls and added peep holes. I never thought twice about letting my 8 year old son attend a bathroom that was a one-person room in a small location...as long as I was outside the room and I knew it looked half way clean. I tried to plan where we went and if we went to a place where there was a controlled bathroom, I begged him to go there and I'd take his sisters too. As for watching the kid's feet under the door? I did that. Boys are VERY aware of women's anatomy at a a lot younger age than most mothers realize. When I had the daycare, I had children in preschool that were VERY exploritory (girls and boys) because they see so much now. I'm sure you remember how boys used to like to see girls underwear in gradeschool back when we were kids....well, it is a lot more agressive now. When I went to public restrooms with my 3 kids, I would have my children stand at the door just where I could see their feet or talk to me for two reasons. One was that I knew where they were...the other was to keep them from peeking through stall doors and disturbing others. My dgd is 4. When we go to public places I usually take her in the handicapped stall with me. I used to be much more paranoid about her when I took her places in a stroller because often it wouldn't fit in the stall which presented all kinds of problems. pam
Bernina 200e, Artista V5 Designer Plus, Explorations, Magic Box, Bernina 2000DE & 335 Bernette Serger, Bernina 1530 Sewing Machine, Bernina 1300 DC Overlock (with coverstitch) |
User: paroper
Member since: 02-03-2004 Total posts: 3775 |
From: Sancin
Date: 02-28-2007, 05:25 PM (29 of 70)
I am not in a position to take children shopping or bathrooms etc, but I think Patsy makes a point when she says types of bathrooms. It is one thing to take a child into a 2 or 3 stall washroom (which is most washrooms in our community other than recreation facilities) and another where the washrooms have different corridors or corners, similar to airports. I get lost in those myself!  Personally when my children were little I ensured they toiletted before they left home (like a mantra to most mothers) as here in the north it is a real production to go to washrooms and divest snow pants, etc to free the body parts. Then a friend who lives in Detroit wrote of a neighbour child of their's being castrated in a washroom. I was never the same again!! Fortunately my children were a little older by then and we only frequented small store washrooms.  Dorothy - love your daily atavars!! *~*~*~* Nancy*~*~*~* " I try to take one day at a time - but sometimes several days attack me at once."
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User: Sancin
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From: Sherri
Date: 02-28-2007, 10:34 PM (30 of 70)
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This is my worry. If we never let our kids do anything by/for themselves (ie independantly) until they are like 12/13 then how can we teach them to be adults by the time they are 16-> 18. Does anyone else think about that? But Of Course I live in a small secluded town in the middle of nowhere. And we go b4 we go most of the time if a bathroom break is required I figure out how to go home. Sher My website
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User: Sherri
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From: Bama
Date: 02-28-2007, 11:45 PM (31 of 70)
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My 5yo son is my biggest worry. He's acts extremely shy to new people (okay, "read" downright rude), but he's small for his size and so immature in some respects. I hope you didn't think I meant that I thought those boys were rude for looking away from me when I spoke. I just thought it was sad that they were so frightened of me and the other woman. My daughter was shy at 5 years old too. After she started school, she was more outgoing. By 5th grade she had a leading role in the school play. I did think the mother was rude by leaving pee on the toilet seat (It was covered not just drops). Especially when the next one in line was a little girl about 3 years old.
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User: Bama
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From: Bama
Date: 02-28-2007, 11:48 PM (32 of 70)
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This is my worry. If we never let our kids do anything by/for themselves (ie independantly) until they are like 12/13 then how can we teach them to be adults by the time they are 16-> 18. Does anyone else think about that? Sher I do. That's exactly what I was thinking about. Thanks for putting it into words for me. |
User: Bama
Member since: 03-21-2000 Total posts: 2116
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From: PaulineG
Date: 03-01-2007, 02:16 AM (33 of 70)
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Maybe this is part of the reason for the growing trend of living at home with your parents until late 20s or even 30s. I don't know about the US but it is increasingly common here in Australia. A lot of it is connected to saving up for their first home but I'm sure a lot of "kids" are avoiding responsibility as well. I guess it's a big scary world out there if you're not prepared for it. Or even if you are.
Pauline
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User: PaulineG
Member since: 09-08-2006 Total posts: 901 |
From: DorothyL
Date: 03-01-2007, 08:22 AM (34 of 70)
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Sher -- I agree with you. I always tried to let my girls do as much as they were could -- maybe even what they only thought they could do and let them fail once in a while. It's hard but you have to let them learn to deal with the world their own way. Like you, I did raise them in a small town but not in the middle of nowhere and we took them to as many places as we could afford so they were not isolated. But they did have a home where they were safe and we were always honest with them. They grew up very different from each other but they are both strong, independent women, able to take care of themselves and help others that need it. And Pauline -- neither live at home, thank goodness. I love them but don't really want to live with them until I am so old they have to take care of me. Dorothy |
User: DorothyL
Member since: 12-09-2002 Total posts: 3883 |
From: paroper
Date: 03-01-2007, 08:22 AM (35 of 70)
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Last weekend two "city" Girl Scouts were selling cookies at a good size gas station in OKC. They were about 10-11 years old. One needed to go to the rest room. As is the Girl Scout rule, their person in charge wouldn't let her go to the bathroom alone, so she took a buddy. A man came into the rest room and tried to grab her. The other girl managed to pull the little girl away from the man and the local gas station attendants managed to catch and keep him until authorities got there. When I was a Girl Scout leader, each summer I was in charge of the local summer Day Camp program which was held in a public park. The city would close the park to the public but it didn't guarantee that we would not have "visitors". My greatest fear were that the visitors would be molestors and perverts. The restrooms were always a place of concern. These are dangerous places for children and often children do not realize the enormity of the problem. I agree that we won't always be able to protect our kids and we have to raise our kids to be self-sufficient but even adults are attacked and kidnapped in public places. We do have to teach our kids what to do in places of danger without alarming them to the point that they are fearful of the public. It is a fine line. The hardest thing for me to get used to is that Girl Scouts do not put leaders in the cabins with the girls at camp. It was hard for me to imagine my second grand daughter at summer camp all week without a leader in the room. Part of that is the phobia that I have after going to college during the Locust Grove/Girl Scout murders (at GS camp). My college was just down the road maybe 15 miles from Locust Grove. You don't forget those kinds of horrible things. Our kids (fortunately in some cases) do not have those experiences. pam
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From: pretnichols
Date: 03-01-2007, 08:29 AM (36 of 70)
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Bama, I'm not offended. I truly mean that as part of my son's shyness, he is downright rude. We are working on it, but it is a challenge. However, I always acknowledge someone who says hello. Most likely, though, you wouldn't be giving me positive feedback on his behavior Plus, he knows enough to clean up after himself if he wets the seat. He's very good about it, especially if I am standing there. I also always remind him before he actually uses a toilet. And Pam, I am now rethinking letting my 9yo go to GS camp. I think we will stick with daycamp this year, and wait until she's a little older. I don't think any child under about 12, should ever be left alone, even in a group, in a camp setting. That's asking for trouble! She has friends going this year, so I will wait for a report back to see how things go for those girls. We were hesitant anyway, since she has never been away from home without being with sokmeon she knows. It sure isn't easy raising kids today! I grew up never having these worries, and I lived in a huge city (Chicago)! Peggy
So little time, sew much to do........... |
User: pretnichols
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From: paroper
Date: 03-01-2007, 08:59 AM (37 of 70)
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I had the option of going the first year with my children to camp as Mom and Me. That was the best thing I could have done for them and for me. It gave me a chance to understand how the camp works and gave us both a feeling of what to expect. As the mother of 3, it gave me special bonding time with each of my girls when their time came. The following year, as scary as it was to let my child, so young, go to GS camp alone, I was so much more comfortable with the idea. In the long run I never regretted sending my kids. My kids and many (most) of the 23 girls in my troop went to camp as soon as it was available to them. As hard as it is to let go...I guarantee it is harder for the parents than the kids. The leaders at camp are very aware and handle things very well. A funny thing happened while I was at Mom and Me the first time. One night while we were there we had terrible tornados, hail and storms in the area. The lady in charge of the camp later told me (personally) that it was a strange night for her. She was glued to the radio but the girls slept through the night (mom's didn't) and she said that there wasn't a single phone call or panicked girl. She said usually the phone rings all night during bad storms and they have to put counselors with the girls in their cabins to comfort them. In future years, when my girls were at camp, I'd be up all night or until the tornado watches cleared the area....and on the phone to other parents who had kids at camp because it is difficult for the parents. Girl Scouts are very aware of safety issues...so much so that they publish publications that give the "rules" to each of the leaders. Some of the things, like the requirement to "tie" girls to moving floats can be a real pain for the leaders, but something that we, the public, rarely consider. They give extensive training to those that work for them to help guarantee the health and safety of the girls in their charge. The reason for not putting counselors in the cabins with the girls is the same reason that the Boy Scouts will not allow men to sleep in enclosures with children other than their own. There is more danger of abuse or accusations relating to people who are around the children all the time than the preceived danger of strangers who have little or no possibility of access to the camp. We are just more aware of "stranger danger". In our camps they have hired security officers that rove the camp all night long on golf carts to insure the personal safety of the girls. The girls cabins are in clusters so that during sleep they are easy to patrol and watch. The GS camps are never without watchguards...even when the leaders take their girls to camp there (off season). pam
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User: paroper
Member since: 02-03-2004 Total posts: 3775 |
From: Sherri
Date: 03-01-2007, 01:17 PM (38 of 70)
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Maybe this is part of the reason for the growing trend of living at home with your parents until late 20s or even 30s. OH boy I don't want to have my kids living with us to 30.  My plan is to be living on the Beach in the french rivera by then. 
My website
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User: Sherri
Member since: 02-07-2001 Total posts: 357 |
From: DorothyL
Date: 03-01-2007, 02:13 PM (39 of 70)
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Wasn't it Erma Bombeck that said when they go away to college "Move and don't give them the address?" Dorothy |
User: DorothyL
Member since: 12-09-2002 Total posts: 3883 |
From: Sherri
Date: 03-01-2007, 08:29 PM (40 of 70)
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Wasn't it Erma Bombeck that said when they go away to college "Move and don't give them the address?" My parents actually did that. They said it was an accident they were busy packing and for got to tell me. I am not so sure The thing I wonder about is it better to protect and shelter our children from the real world or teach them how to deal with it. And where is the line we draw? I mean on one hand you want your kids to be safe and have a great childhood. But on the other hand at some point in time they need to know how to live in the world around them. Sher My website
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User: Sherri
Member since: 02-07-2001 Total posts: 357 |
From: PaulineG
Date: 03-01-2007, 09:30 PM (41 of 70)
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The thing I wonder about is it better to protect and shelter our children from the real world or teach them how to deal with it. And where is the line we draw? Sher Our lines are all in different places - that's the confusing bit for us as parents. All depends so much on the child, the environment, our beliefs ... And sometimes having drawn the line we need to rub it out and start again. If we weren't/aren't just a little bit uncertain it probably means we aren't thinking about it hard enough. Pauline
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User: PaulineG
Member since: 09-08-2006 Total posts: 901 |
From: Magot
Date: 03-01-2007, 10:40 PM (42 of 70)
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That is the most sensible thought on the whole thing Pauline - it is a fluid process bringing up kids - what is right and loving at one stage in their life can be so wrong and damaging at another. I am trying the "Move and don't give them the address technique" - we are moving to a smaller house soon - both kids are at Uni and then what happens but we have 5 of them wanting to come and stay at the same time in the new house - Well, we will have cardboard boxes we can put them in.... I think so much of why kids come home after Uni is finacial consideration - back in the day you went to where the work was and then found somewhere to live as opposed to crashing at M and D's and then finding a job... love and kisses, Jan
Guts-R-Us Cells a Speciality DNA to order. |
User: Magot
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From: DorothyL
Date: 03-02-2007, 08:01 AM (43 of 70)
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When my daughter moved to Brooklyn she threatened to make us stay at YMCA when we come to visit Dorothy |
User: DorothyL
Member since: 12-09-2002 Total posts: 3883 |
From: plrlegal
Date: 03-02-2007, 03:42 PM (44 of 70)
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Dorothy you were apparently wise enough or out of necessity taught your girls to be self-sufficient at early ages whereas in my particular family, the nieces and nephews that that are still living at home but should already be out on their own were never taught to be self-sufficient and still depend on "Mom" to cook, clean and wait on them hand and foot. Patsy Patsy
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User: plrlegal
Member since: 05-19-2001 Total posts: 318 |
From: Pudge99
Date: 03-02-2007, 04:41 PM (45 of 70)
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OK ladies this is me opening my mouth wide and inserting my foot in it. Don't have a little smiley for that. Just four days ago I posted that none of the kids in my neighborhood walk to school. Well today one of the mothers apporoached me and said that her son and a few of the other kids on our street are walking home now and would I like my son (9 yrs. old) to join them. This is a tough one for me. My son is an asthmatic and we still have that big mulch fire burning nearby. On top of that as far as I know there is no way for them to walk home without passing a known sex offenders house. Plus there is the fact that it is a mile from my front door to the school. I know that I was not walking a mile from my home when I was his age. I can come up with all sorts of reasons not to let him do it. I guess what I need from you sensible ladies is reasons why I should and suggestions for how to make it as safe as possible for him. Gina
Pictures of my successes and failures Pfaff 2040 Janome Mylock 134D Singer Futura CE-100 w/ Autopunch Husqvarna Viking 3D Sketch |
User: Pudge99
Member since: 10-30-2001 Total posts: 1375 |
From: Magot
Date: 03-02-2007, 04:51 PM (46 of 70)
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Is it of any help to you to know that mine walked a mile and a half to school at 9? What I find even more shocking is I used to travel on a bus with my big brother 2 miles (public transport not a school bus) when he was 8 and I was 5. If they are travelling together and he always goes buddied up it shouldn't be so bad. I assume he carries his inhaler - I would be more concerned about that. I walked mine along the route - showed the safe places to cross the roads and explained the way I expected them to go and that they were to walk together with a friend. After 2 weeks of this I used to walk along the route about 200 yards behind and on the other side of the road to make sure they knew the crossing places and after 3 weeks my daughter was begging me to let her get on with it. Other parents still meet their children at 13 when they live 800 yards away. Boys aged 9-15 are the most likely to have an accident on the road as they are so unroadworthy. The younger ones think that if I have done my part of the ritual to cross the road it is now safe... the older ones are just too careless. Our major problem round here is children cutting across the railway line - we have been fighting for a footbridge for 20 years, to little avail, and still the kids break the fence down and save a mile on their walk by crossing the tracks. love and kisses, Jan
Guts-R-Us Cells a Speciality DNA to order. |
User: Magot
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From: Patty22
Date: 03-02-2007, 05:31 PM (47 of 70)
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"That is the most sensible thought on the whole thing Pauline - it is a fluid process bringing up kids - what is right and loving at one stage in their life can be so wrong and damaging at another." Reminds me of when my oldest daughter was around 4 my parents came to visit; they only saw my kids once or twice a year as they lived out of state. As soon as they pulled in the driveway my father asked my daughter if she would like to get in the car and go get an ice cream cone. My daughter told him no because he was a stranger. My father was pissed to say the least and I told my daughter how proud of her because she remembered everything I had told her. My father didn't realize, or didn't remember that earlier that year a man with a woman's scalp on his head had been driving around the neighborhood and had actually tried to pick up a young girl by the elementary school. I think every generation/or parent has to do what they feel is right for their own circumstances. I only allowed my kids to play in the back yard and never in the front; the arrangement is what made me comfortable and less stressful. Heck, when I was a kid my mother locked us out of the house and told us to go to the woods and play; something I never did with my kids. Patty
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User: Patty22
Member since: 03-29-2006 Total posts: 1194 |
From: PaulineG
Date: 03-02-2007, 10:11 PM (48 of 70)
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Gina to be honest although you asked for reasons why you should it doesn't sound like that's what you really want. There are plenty of reasons for and against but the decision is yours and no amount of input from us (or your neighbours) will make you comfortable if you really don't want him to do it. However, playing devils advocate here - Reasons for walking - building indpendence, aerobic fitness (which will help with asthma in the long term), increased responsibility. Ways to increase safety - mobile phone (if you care to), inhaler, rules about road safety, talking to strangers etc. Minimum numbers of kids walking. Adults taking turns (on a roster or something) to walk with them or at least keeping them in sight. Our local school has what's called a walking school bus project whereby the kids meet at "bus stops" at certain times of the morning and "conductors" (screened and police checked) walk them to and from school. My kids no longer go to the local school (long story) but most people who use the "bus" do so for convenience rather than any expected positive outcome. Personally I think that although there is some positive here none of the above reasons is compelling enough to make me go against what I believe or feel. There are plenty of other ways to achieve these aims. I have to ask though - why are you considering it if you are uncomfortable? And what are the reasons for the others in the neighbourhood as well? Pauline
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User: PaulineG
Member since: 09-08-2006 Total posts: 901 |
From: paroper
Date: 03-02-2007, 11:24 PM (49 of 70)
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I don't know about her area but the general rule around here is that is the child is within a mile...I think in some areas it is now 1 1/2 miles from school they must find their own way. For most, whose mothers and dads both work, that means either foot or bike.
pam
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User: paroper
Member since: 02-03-2004 Total posts: 3775 |
From: Hogmami
Date: 03-03-2007, 07:00 AM (50 of 70)
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In my school district, they pick the kids up on the bus even if they are a block from the school. I live a block from the school and the kids next door are picked up and dropped off. I know why its done but what makes me upset is after school they walk to the school playground to play. Anymore bussing is a big part of the school budget and when they keep asking for more money, it gets a little tough to give it to them when you see things like that. I don't see anything wrong with the kids walking a couple of blocks to school. I know I can't afford more taxes. In some of the school districts around here, they have cut out bussing. Its up to the parents to get there kids to school. And I know its hard for parents to do this if they work.
Carolyn
Michigan |
User: Hogmami
Member since: 09-30-2004 Total posts: 800 
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From: paroper
Date: 03-03-2007, 09:08 AM (51 of 70)
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Well, for the most part, I don't see anything wrong with kids in small towns walking to school even if they are pretty young as long as they are in a group. Most of the younger kids in our town walk with older kids, brothers and sisters, next door neighbors. There are some limits because the kids jr high and high school in our town are in another spot. However, by the time a child gets to 9-10 years old, if they are in a group they are pretty much mature enough to walk with little problem. In a small town we tend to get a little complacient. Last year an 11 year old girl on the way to school alone was approached by a stranger...and in a small town you know a stranger...she ran to a convience store on the way to school and called her female 6th grade teacher who sent a couple of teachers to pick her up at the store. In all the years that I've lived around here (54) I can't remember another instance of that sort happening on the way to school. When I was in high school in the 70's a local man was stalking a jr in high school....he would follow her as she walked home from work in the down town district and started breaking into her house while she slept, never hurt her. One night her parents woke up and he was standing over them..her dad pursued him with a shot gun, shot at his feet just as he jumped into a ditch in front of the house..it ended up that the man was shot in the back and died. The father was put on trial for murder but I don't know what happened with the trial as I went away to college during that time. The thing is that it doesn't happen very often and when it does, most kids manage to get away before they are touched. The best we can do is give them the ability to make quick decisions, make our decisions based on their maturity and keep a watchful eye out on them. Full grown adults disappear too. You need to always be alert though. Most of the adults I know who were abused as children were not abused by strangers, they were abused most often by family members (siblings and adults), neighbors, teachers, and occasionally church aquaintances. pam
Bernina 200e, Artista V5 Designer Plus, Explorations, Magic Box, Bernina 2000DE & 335 Bernette Serger, Bernina 1530 Sewing Machine, Bernina 1300 DC Overlock (with coverstitch) |
User: paroper
Member since: 02-03-2004 Total posts: 3775 |
From: DorothyL
Date: 03-03-2007, 09:43 AM (52 of 70)
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Where we lived when my kids were little if they lived in the village they walked (except kindergartners). For some -- including mine -- it was about a mile. Of course there were a lot of them on the street at the same time and someone at strategic corners to help them cross streets and keep an eye on them. Even in kindergarten my youngest wanted to walk with the neighbors. She was supposed to stick with her older sister but wouldn't so they made a deal. Her sister would keep an eye out from a distance. What does your son want to do -- or do you consider that at all? Dorothy |
User: DorothyL
Member since: 12-09-2002 Total posts: 3883 |
From: paroper
Date: 03-03-2007, 09:48 AM (53 of 70)
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There is also a lot of bonding that happens on these "to school" walks. It is a bit of an honor to be asked to walk with a group. If your son is left out, often he will be left out socially too. When the other kids start walking to school, there is often a social stigma attached to those whose parents are considered to be too protective and, especially in a smaller town, that stigma can carry on through graduation.
pam
Bernina 200e, Artista V5 Designer Plus, Explorations, Magic Box, Bernina 2000DE & 335 Bernette Serger, Bernina 1530 Sewing Machine, Bernina 1300 DC Overlock (with coverstitch) |
User: paroper
Member since: 02-03-2004 Total posts: 3775 |
From: Patty22
Date: 03-03-2007, 11:55 AM (54 of 70)
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There is also a lot of bonding that happens on these "to school" walks. It is a bit of an honor to be asked to walk with a group. If your son is left out, often he will be left out socially too. When the other kids start walking to school, there is often a social stigma attached to those whose parents are considered to be too protective and, especially in a smaller town, that stigma can carry on through graduation. Pam I don't agree with choosing to send your child out the door with a group of kids just so they don't have a "stigma." As a parent, I believe safety issues are a priority over popularity. I don't believe I would have any hesitations if I knew the kids and the parents, but otherwise, honor or no honor, I would find an alternative. Listen to your intuition. If for some reason you aren't completely comfortable with the situation, don't allow him to walk with the group. If otherwise, let him go and go back and read some of Pauline's wonderful suggestions, such as a cell/mobile phone. Patty
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User: Patty22
Member since: 03-29-2006 Total posts: 1194 |
From: DorothyL
Date: 03-03-2007, 12:30 PM (55 of 70)
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You can get those cell phones that will only call about four numbers that you program in. If I had little ones they would have one of those for sure -- of course they would lose or break it, I'm sure, Dorothy |
User: DorothyL
Member since: 12-09-2002 Total posts: 3883 |
From: dmoses
Date: 03-03-2007, 12:35 PM (56 of 70)
The biggest worry my kids had going to and coming from school were the bullies...yes, other people's darling  .
Take care,
Donna |
User: dmoses
Member since: 02-22-2002 Total posts: 964
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From: PaulineG
Date: 03-03-2007, 02:28 PM (57 of 70)
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Dorothy had a good point - what does your son want to do - is that why you're giving it so much thought? There is a lot of fun to be had with the right group of kids when you're free of adult supervision (gee that came out sounding scary - which was not all my intention). There are so many things to consider! Hope you're getting clearer about your decision rather than more confused. Remember though - whichever decision you make is not irreversible. You can give it a try and see how it works out or opt to wait "just a little bit longer". Pauline
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User: PaulineG
Member since: 09-08-2006 Total posts: 901 |
From: Pudge99
Date: 03-03-2007, 03:18 PM (58 of 70)
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Well I did talk to my son and he is the only reason I am even considering it. There were a couple of posts about how it is in small towns. I wish that I lived in one but unfortunately there are 1 1/2 million people living in this town. I have known most of these kids for the 4 1/2 years we have lived here. My son has been playing with them this whole time. I have a small concern because when my son plays with the other boy in the group he often gets hurt. Not intentionally. They are the exteme opposites on the growth chart. My son being the smaller. So the larger boy just doesn't realize he is being to rough. Then there is the whole peer pressure thing. I know my son knows and follows the rules, but what is going to happen when everybody else runs across the street with no crosswalk? Do I tell my son to stay with them so he is still with the group or do I tell him to follow the rules and walk alone? Oh and should they change their route to avoid stalking or should they walk the same way everyday so we know where to find them? I really do think it would do him some good to walk home but I am just a very paranoid parent. I guess I need to sit down and talk with the other mothers to see what measures they have in place already. Gina
Pictures of my successes and failures Pfaff 2040 Janome Mylock 134D Singer Futura CE-100 w/ Autopunch Husqvarna Viking 3D Sketch |
User: Pudge99
Member since: 10-30-2001 Total posts: 1375 |
From: Patty22
Date: 03-03-2007, 06:30 PM (59 of 70)
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Gina, that sounds really sensible. The peer pressure is a big issue. Several years ago (about 5 years ago) a woman I knew in a neighboring town allowed her daughter (middle school) to walk with a group of kids to school. The big peer pressure issue at the time was sex. This group of kids convinced this girl that she should have sex to experience it because it was no big deal. The kids brought her to a house after school where another boy was upstairs in the bedroom and she was locked in the bedroom with him as the friends guarded the door. He proceeded to have sex with her against her will. I guess the girl was screaming for help but the "friends" wouldn't let her out. My friend told me this story about three weeks after it had happened and I was mortified as she relayed the information on the phone. I asked her if she went to the police to report that her daughter was raped. She said no because she didn't want to "taint" her daughter's reputation as being "easy." Evidently the boy came from a "nice" family and it would destoy the family. I asked her if she had taken her daughter to the doctor to get checked for STD's. She said no. I was disgusted; well, I was more furious this woman, who I thought was sensible was so stupid. I always wondered how many more innocent young girls were destroyed by this kind of incident happening again and she didn't prevent it. Patty
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User: Patty22
Member since: 03-29-2006 Total posts: 1194 |
From: Sancin
Date: 03-03-2007, 07:26 PM (60 of 70)
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One of the things I did with my children was sit down and talk to them about what they would do in x situation/s. It gave me some idea of how they protected themselves and gave me a chance to teach them some skills and things to watch out for. One of mine I never had any worry about as he could talk himself out of a steel vault, and still can, the other not so. It was particularly helpful when they became involved in events that took them out of our neighbourhood to sport or cultural locations. My daughter had a friend who I thought was a poor influence on her and was very much a daredevil and was a friend for far longer than I liked. When it came to discussing what to do when others were driving cars and who went where I was very impressed with my daughter's comments and thereafter felt quite comfortable with her ability to protect herself and make appropriate decisions. Years later she told me got a little tired of always being the designated driver!! *~*~*~* Nancy*~*~*~* " I try to take one day at a time - but sometimes several days attack me at once."
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User: Sancin
Member since: 02-13-2005 Total posts: 895
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From: paroper
Date: 03-03-2007, 07:53 PM (61 of 70)
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We spend the first few months of thier lives trying to teach them to do things on their own, walk, talk, feed themselves, potty training...then we spend the rest of their lives trying to let go of them..it is really hard..from the first day of preschool/kindergarten/babysitter to summer camp, spending the night away from home (friend's house), driving a car to their moving out and into a college dorm!
pam
Bernina 200e, Artista V5 Designer Plus, Explorations, Magic Box, Bernina 2000DE & 335 Bernette Serger, Bernina 1530 Sewing Machine, Bernina 1300 DC Overlock (with coverstitch) |
User: paroper
Member since: 02-03-2004 Total posts: 3775 |
From: pigeon
Date: 03-16-2007, 03:18 PM (62 of 70)
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My dd was potty training and one night we went out to dinner to a buffet style chinese place. well she had to go to the bathroom every 5 minutes so eventually I told my husband "it's your turn!" so he took her in and she went, and he kept her in the stall while he went. Well in my family we are pretty open about our bodies while the kids are young. Anyway my three year old daughter shouts out: "Daddy you have a BIG penis!" to my husband's dismay there were other men in the bathroom using the urinals. Needless to say, my husband was beet red when he came out of there! Now he is very self conscious about being naked in front of her, and won't pee in front of her anymore. |
User: pigeon
Member since: 03-15-2007 Total posts: 10 |
From: Domestic Goddes
Date: 03-16-2007, 04:30 PM (63 of 70)
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Oh dear. Reading all of this is giving me feelings of "irresponsible parenting". Have I been doing it right? Or have I been doing it wrong?Up until the age of 9 my daughter (now nearly 13) always went into the Gents (mensroom) cubicle with her father if she needed to pee and never thought anything of it. Try going into public toilets in France - men on one side and women on the other, although the ladies do have cubicles. Frenchmen generally have no inhibitions and wave everything about. Until she was about 7, she always squeezed into the same cubicle as me, then there wasn't enough room so we would take turns and she would chat to me when I was in there so I knew she was OK. She's been a "latch key kid" since September 2005 when she started at High School, walking to the bus stop, catching a bus and travelling 10 miles to school and then the reverse in evenings - even during the dark winter evenings. She has her own key and is responsible for setting the alarms and locking up each morning, as we leave her in the house on her own from 6.30 am until she departs for school at 7.30 am. She's often on her own in the house after school for at least an hour, sometimes several. But then what do you expect, I did abandon her in a nursery each day from her being 3 months old so I could further my career aspirations. She's been allowed to play in the mud, climb trees, get her front teeth knocked out by a football, eat worms and fall off skateboards. We do have safeguards in place - neighbours that keep an eye on her, calling her on her mobile phone (cell phone) to make sure she's ok. She's been allowed to take risks, find her own way and develop her own solutions to problems. I have a fiercely independant, clever, respectful, strong and feisty child who takes nonsense from no-one, is assertive without being agressive but does know how to physically defend herself. I've nurtured this through being protective in every discreet way possible but at the same time letting her know that it's a big bad world out there and to trust only those she knows that I and her father trust. Over-protecting our children is almost as cruel as letting them run wild and not obey the rules. They will never find their own way, never grow, but develop tendancies towards paranoia and anxiety. That's my pen'orth. |
User: Domestic Goddes
Member since: 01-04-2005 Total posts: 108 |
From: Magot
Date: 03-16-2007, 04:57 PM (64 of 70)
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Go for it Dom! We need risk in our lives - she sounds British to me! After all, mine hit each other with swords...
love and kisses, Jan
Guts-R-Us Cells a Speciality DNA to order. |
User: Magot
Member since: 12-22-2002 Total posts: 3626
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From: DorothyL
Date: 03-16-2007, 05:03 PM (65 of 70)
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I agree, you have to let them grow. I remember many sleepless nights when my daughter was on the road. And before that sitting in the window barely able to breath when my kid was walking home -- about 3 blocks -- from dance class on a dark winter night -- like at 5 p.m. But you gotta let them go. Dorothy |
User: DorothyL
Member since: 12-09-2002 Total posts: 3883 |
From: Sancin
Date: 03-16-2007, 05:15 PM (66 of 70)
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She could also be northern Canadian. I had a similar lifestyle as Dom with my youngsters, now adult. While other neighbours were driving their children to school because of bear rumors I was telling my son not to talk to them if he ran into them and definitely not bring them home - as he did with a whole flock of geese once. When my daughter started home economics in junior high school she came home and said the first class was interesting as most of the class had never been allowed to turn the stove on at home and had to be taught at school.  She was actually a rather nervous girl but once she got a car, which she bought and paid for on her own at 17, she drove all over the country on her own going places to check out better schooling for herself - and being pursued by different uni's as being a self starter.
*~*~*~* Nancy*~*~*~* " I try to take one day at a time - but sometimes several days attack me at once."
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User: Sancin
Member since: 02-13-2005 Total posts: 895
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From: DorothyL
Date: 03-17-2007, 08:43 AM (67 of 70)
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While other neighbours were driving their children to school because of bear rumors I was telling my son not to talk to them That's great. I was a latch key kid at eight or nine. I'm sure my mom didn't like it but she was a single mom and had no choice. And she sure couldn't afford child care. Dorothy |
User: DorothyL
Member since: 12-09-2002 Total posts: 3883 |
From: pretnichols
Date: 03-17-2007, 09:42 AM (68 of 70)
I too, was a latch key kid at 9. I do have older siblings who had a key. However, after spending many afternoons sitting on the front steps waiting for them to come home, my Mom gave me my own key. We lived on a very busy 4 lane street. I will admit I was beyond naive about strangers, etc.--if you talked to me I answered (respect adults, etc.) I led a very sheltered lifestyle by my parents choice (I couldn't leave the block we lived on until I was 12), but I could walk to and home from school by myself everyday, which was about 5 blocks or so (go figure?). As long as you are comfortable with what you are teaching your child, you have to stick with it. Keep in mind, some children are more mature earlier, while others can't be trusted until they are in their early teens. Go with you gut instinct and you'll do fine (and earn a few more grey hairs to boot).
Peggy
So little time, sew much to do........... |
User: pretnichols
Member since: 10-16-2005 Total posts: 342 |
From: mommydionne
Date: 03-17-2007, 02:53 PM (69 of 70)
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It's tough, but we let the kids do more each year, my older two (now 10 and 8) take the school bus but before the that would get dropped off at school by me (we had lived out of district and I had to drive them) but walked about a mile to the sitters after school with her daughter (11), my oldest rides his bike all over the neighborhood (he is not allowed on main street b/c the traffic is insane). He's pretty resourcefull too, one day I was in the basement and the front door was locked when they got off the bus, so instead of ringing the doorbell (my first thought?) he punched in the code to the garage doors and brought everyone in. We do live on a nice quiet street and everyone seems to know everyone so that helps. But we still are part of the City of Ottawa so that is still a good size place (close to a million now). Oh... Domestic Goddess I shipped my kiddies off to daycare early too  (6 weeks for numero uno, I was the employed member of our family, DH was still in school, gotta eat!)
Jeanette
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User: mommydionne
Member since: 01-08-2004 Total posts: 838
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From: allie-oops
Date: 03-18-2007, 06:25 PM (70 of 70)
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Wow this topic really took off. My boys are 14 and 12 now, and I still make them go to the men's room together - my youngest has a form of Asperger's, and can be a little too dare-devilish. When they were about 8 and 6, I let them go to the men's room, but if anyone was in there they were to come out immediately and wait. Also, I had them count out loud while they were in there. If the counting was interrupted, I went right in. I taught it to them as a game, and they enjoyed it. The problem is, there are SO MANY predators, and they're not just after young kids. Kids my sons' ages are disappearing, and they're not runaways. On our street alone are 3 registered sex offenders. How many aren't registered? I want my boys to be independent, but they must also be cautious. I'm trying to teach both. Our neighborhood has not only predators, but gangs as well - my boys don't walk to their friend's houses down the street, I drive them. And did I mention the loose dogs? Sheesh. I try to weigh the inconvience of driving them with the "what if" question. One thing I'd dearly love to do is get them involved in Tae Kwon Do - not only for self-defense, which I think everyone should know, but for the discipline it teaches. I just don't think there IS such a thing as being too safe anymore. I hate that they're growing up this way, I know I didn't, but at least they are growing up. "onward through the fog"
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User: allie-oops
Member since: 10-25-2002 Total posts: 282 
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